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Multiple attachment points (was: Double attachment points) 
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Joined: 2009-03-18 09:32:02
Posts: 245
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any chance to get multiple clothes layers as well?

in viewer 2.1 you can wear not only more than one attachment per attachpoint, but also more than one clothes item per layer, for example...

a tattoo and a pair of boxers that both go on underwear layer...

there's a thingie in the "edit this outfit" tab that lets you rearrange what goes on top of what... a possible way to do this in CV without adding extra UI elements would be the old "dress from the bottom up" rule, what goes on last is on top, in RL it's kinda hard to put on something that

bye,
LC


2010-09-19 07:23:03
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Joined: 2009-03-18 09:32:02
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Henri Beauchamp wrote:
First, let me say that there is one known issue: multiple attachments do not stay attached after a relog (only one attachment per point will stay after relog). I searched a lot for what could be wrong, but so far found nothing in the code that could explain this... I will have to see with newer branches of viewer 2, since this backport is based on Snowglobe v2.1 (pre-Snowstorm) and the early v2 viewers were known to have such issues as well...



A suggestion / thought:

when the avatar receives the initial appearance on login, for each item do an "add to outfit" instead of "wear"... of course this would require that the initial appearance is completely empty before this starts...

Another suggestion:
the "Current outfit" folder, in 2.x, holds nothing but links to items that are worn at the moment that you look in the folder...
So, to make sure appearances are compatible between 1.5 and 2.1, every time you "wear" or "add " an item, create a link to that item in "Current Outfit", and every time you detach one item / clothes layer / body part, remove the link.
Then, on logging in, you could just simply run a "replace outfit" on that folder...


2010-09-21 07:48:50
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Joined: 2009-03-17 18:42:51
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Lance Corrimal wrote:
A suggestion / thought:

when the avatar receives the initial appearance on login, for each item do an "add to outfit" instead of "wear"... of course this would require that the initial appearance is completely empty before this starts...
This is already the case (the default is now to always "Add" when attaching objects, and "Wear" only happens on the callback for the actual Wear action).

Quote:
Another suggestion:
the "Current outfit" folder, in 2.x, holds nothing but links to items that are worn at the moment that you look in the folder...
So, to make sure appearances are compatible between 1.5 and 2.1, every time you "wear" or "add " an item, create a link to that item in "Current Outfit", and every time you detach one item / clothes layer / body part, remove the link.
Then, on logging in, you could just simply run a "replace outfit" on that folder...
No, even without any link in the Outfits folder, v2.1 is able to reattach any previously worn attachment on login. I suspect that in fact, the objects are rezzed right out with the avatar as their parent on login, i.e. there is no "attach" action done on login (which would be coherent with the fact that in LSL, only the on_rez() event is fired, not the attach() one).
The only problem is to find out where, in the 24Mb of diff between v1.23 and v2.1, the required change in the code could be... For now, RL is preventing me to look further (thus why I released the viewer with the multiple attachments feature "as is" last week-end), but I'll look into it later.


2010-09-21 19:45:58
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I found the problem. Alas, the new sim servers do not store multiple attachments per point (even with viewer 2: I was mislead and thought viewer 2 could reattach multiple attachments even without the links "Current Outfit" folder, but when testing it, I simply forgot those links are automatically re-created when removed by another viewer version in a previous session).

So, in fact, multiple attachments are mainly handled viewer-side (which I think is very unwise, since someone could temper with the maximum attachments per avatar in ways that would bring the sim servers to their knees...), and there must be a way for the viewer to store the worn attachments list so to restore them on relog...

Viewer 2 does this with the "Current Outfit" folder, the problem being that I don't like having my root folder cluttered with useless folders (you can't edit the contents of the "Current Outfit" folder in viewer 2, and the Worn tab is there already in the Cool VL Viewer to tell you what you are wearing, also listing the folders the worn items are held in, unlike what happens with the "Current Outfit" folder of viewer 2), neither to have the viewer creating new objects by itself (here links) in my inventory and in my back (what happens in case of asset server issues (you know, those times when you get a blue dialog from a Linden, telling you to "refrain from rezzing, etc.." ?... Could get your inventory corrupted...). Also, if you look at the code for the COF (Current Outfit Folder) support in viewer 2, it is quite complex (it has to deal with inventory loading and asset server delays, for example), and while portable, I don't feel like implementing it in the Cool VL Viewer, or at least, not for now.

I therefore implemented it in another (and much simpler, code-wise) way. Instead of creating links in an useless folder, I create a XML list of worn attachments in the same directory as the settings per account XML file (which means that each attachment list is held in the corresponding avatar directory for the corresponding grid). The only drawback of this method it that, should you log in from another computer, the attachments list will not be up to date with your last logout.
The next Cool VL Viewer releases will implement this, bringing full support for multiple attachments.


2010-09-24 19:36:29
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Hmm... how about this line of thought:


by now, almost everyone has at least tried viewer two once, and thus has a "current outfit" folder. So, if that folder is present, might as well use it... since there's no way of deleting it :/

If it is not (as in, user has not tried viewer2 yet), do the xml file in ~/.secondlife/username/ instead.

that way, if the user in question actually switches between cool viewer and lets say kirsten sometimes, the outfit won't get broken; and if the user never touched 2.0 so far, he won't have the annoying extra folders...


2010-09-25 09:17:08
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Lance Corrimal wrote:
Hmm... how about this line of thought:

by now, almost everyone has at least tried viewer two once, and thus has a "current outfit" folder.
I tried viewer 2 only with a secondary avatar, and I'm glad I did, since it means that my main avatar didn't have its inventory polluted with viewer 2's stupid system folders...

Quote:
So, if that folder is present, might as well use it... since there's no way of deleting it :/
I'd rather allow to delete this folder (or at least hide it) in the Cool VL Viewer...

Quote:
If it is not (as in, user has not tried viewer2 yet), do the xml file in ~/.secondlife/username/ instead.

that way, if the user in question actually switches between cool viewer and lets say kirsten sometimes, the outfit won't get broken; and if the user never touched 2.0 so far, he won't have the annoying extra folders...
I don't see the point in implementing the two methods... Either I'll keep my own, XML file method, or I will implement viewer 2's. For now, I'll just wait and see what's people feedback about my method.

As for compatibility, I'll simply remark that viewer 2's method is even less compatible. Try this:
  • Login with viewer 2
  • Log off
  • Login with any v1 viewer, and change your outfit.
  • Log off
  • Login with viewer 2: surprise ! Your outfit is changed back to what it was when logging off last time from viewer 2 ! Note that this could be a problem if you last logged off from viewer 2 with an explicitly sexual outfit, and changed to a mundane outfit before moving to a PG region before logging off with viewer 1; you would then find yourself in a sexually explicit attire in a PG region when logging in the next time with viewer 2...

With my method, the only things you "loose" when switching between viewer versions are the multiple attachments (i.e. you may have attachments restored from a previous Cool VL Viewer session).

EDIT: oh, and there's another very important reason why my method is better... It's compatible with OpenSim grids, while viewer 2's is not (OpenSim servers do not support inventory item links, or at least not for now...).


2010-09-25 13:12:18
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OK, the new releases of the Cool VL Viewer (v1.23.5.30 and v1.25.0.7) now implement full support for multiple attachments, including auto-reattach on relog. I also added a new context menu item for folders: "Wear items" attaches the objects in the folder and does kick any already worn item on the points they attach to (I found this quite useful since "Add to outfit" now doesn't kick attachments any more, which can be an annoyance, for example when replacing a set of cuffs with another).

I edited the original post accordingly.


2010-09-25 16:55:08
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Joined: 2010-04-30 23:14:32
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Henri Beauchamp wrote:
I also added a new context menu item for folders: "Wear items" attaches the objects in the folder and does kick any already worn item on the points they attach to (I found this quite useful since "Add to outfit" now doesn't kick attachments any more, which can be an annoyance, for example when replacing a set of cuffs with another).


I logged on specifically to complain about the broken "Add to outfit" problem, and here you already fixed it before I could complain. Well played as always, Henri! :)


2010-10-17 16:21:02
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SegmentationFault wrote:
Henri Beauchamp wrote:
I also added a new context menu item for folders: "Wear items" attaches the objects in the folder and does kick any already worn item on the points they attach to (I found this quite useful since "Add to outfit" now doesn't kick attachments any more, which can be an annoyance, for example when replacing a set of cuffs with another).


I logged on specifically to complain about the broken "Add to outfit" problem, and here you already fixed it before I could complain. Well played as always, Henri! :)
It is in no way "broken", it was just made consistent ("Add to outfit" to "add"... ditto), and compatible with viewer 2's own behaviour. But since the old behaviour was also useful and desirable to have, I added the "Wear items" functionality.


2010-10-17 17:05:07
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Joined: 2010-12-09 21:11:30
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exactly how does this feature work now? I'm used to seeing the extra points on the menu.


2010-12-09 21:47:01
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